Meksyk

[johnny21]

Zaczytalem sie wczoraj o TJ i sasiednich miasteczkach oraz wszedlem na forum poswiecone Amerykanom mieszkajacym w TJ i zdecydowanie nie jest polecane tanie zamieszkanie w TJ z mysla o dojezdzaniu do sasiadnego San Diego. Bardzo niebezpieczne miasto i jeszcze bardziej niebezpieczne miasto dla gringo czyli nie-Meksykanina. Duzo zwyklych przestepstw jak kradzieze, kradzieze aut. Wojna miedzy mafia narkotykowa a policja i wojskiem, nagle strzelaniny w roznych czesciach miasta. Ginie mnostwo niewinnych przypadkowych ludzi. Szok.

http://www.tijuanablog.com/index.php?

http://projects.latimes.com/mexico-drug-wa...interactive-map

[Wojtek-J]

Moze byc nieciekawie

Dodam ciekawostke ... 'gringo' nie oznacza nie-Meksykanina - to konkretnie osoba pochodzaca z USA.

Zwrot jest raczej pogardliwy (chociaz wszedl do jezyka codziennego) i wywodzi sie od slowa 'green' (zielony, czyli glupi i niczego nierozumiejacy).

W Ameryce Poludniowej wyraz ten ma nieco inne znaczenie niz w Meksyku ...

[Magnum]

Moze byc nieciekawie

Dodam ciekawostke ... 'gringo' nie oznacza nie-Meksykanina - to konkretnie osoba pochodzaca z USA.

Zwrot jest raczej pogardliwy (chociaz wszedl do jezyka codziennego) i wywodzi sie od slowa 'green' (zielony, czyli glupi i niczego nierozumiejacy).

W Ameryce Poludniowej wyraz ten ma nieco inne znaczenie niz w Meksyku ...

Gringo (hiszp.) ? pierwotnie mianem tym w krajach Ameryki Łacińskiej, a także w Hiszpanii określano cudzoziemca oraz osoby nie mówiące po hiszpańsku. Z czasem nabrało ono pogardliwego wydźwięku na określenie osób pochodzących ze Stanów Zjednoczonych bądź Anglii, by w końcu stać się przymiotnikiem określającym osoby o urodzie charakterystycznej dla krajów północy. Potoczne określenie w Ameryce Południowej na turystę.

tyle definicji slownikowej, teraz wojtku jak jest w rzeczywistosci?

[Wojtek-J]

Gringo (hiszp.) - pierwotnie mianem tym w krajach Ameryki Łacińskiej, a także w Hiszpanii określano cudzoziemca oraz osoby nie mówiące po hiszpańsku. Z czasem nabrało ono pogardliwego wydźwięku na określenie osób pochodzących ze Stanów Zjednoczonych bądź Anglii, by w końcu stać się przymiotnikiem określającym osoby o urodzie charakterystycznej dla krajów północy. Potoczne określenie w Ameryce Południowej na turystę.

tyle definicji slownikowej, teraz wojtku jak jest w rzeczywistosci?

Definicje sa rozne - zaleznie od zrodla (o tym ponizej).

Spotkalem sie ze slowem 'gringo' w Meksyku, w Gwatemali, w Chile i w Argentynie - i nie zawsze znaczylo ono to samo.

Meksykanie i Gwatemalczycy uzywali go w odniesieniu do obywateli USA i nierzadko bylo to okreslenie pogardliwe, kilkoro Meksykanow powiedzialo mi to, co napisalem w poprzedniej wypowiedzi (czyli, ze wyraz ten pochodzi od slowa 'green' i ze zwiazany jest z 'glupota'). Po przeczytaniu Twojej definicji zerknalem na angielska wersje Wikipedii - tlumaczy ona pochodzenie slowa i podaje kilka wariantow. Do mnie przemawia najbardziej motyw z piesnia "... green grow ...". Jak jest w rzeczywistosci - chyba nikt w stu procentach nie wie

W Argentynie i Chile ewidentnie stosowano to slowo w odniesieniu do 'swoich' (widocznie imigrantow europejskich, ktorych szczegolnie w Argentynie jest sporo) i w odniesieniu do obcokrajowcow (nie tylko z USA) - dlatego wlasnie napisalem, ze w Poludniowej Ameryce slowo 'gringo' ma nieco inne znacznie (i zgadzaloby sie to z definicjami angielskiej Wikipedii).

Zacytowales informacje z polskiej Wikipedii, ale wystarczy zerknac na angielska i rozni sie ona nieco - co zrodlo, to inna wersja

'Gringo (feminine, gringa) is a Spanish and Portuguese word used in Latin America to generally denote people from the United States, but in some cases it is also used to denote foreign non-native speakers of Spanish (physical appearance i.e. race often plays a role), usually from northern Europe or Canada - especially English-speakers.Anglophones may consider the word pejorative, and dictionaries such as the American Heritage Dictionary classify gringo as 'offensive slang,' 'usually disparaging,' and 'often disparaging.'However, Hispanophones disagree on whether or not gringo is derogatory; it is not considered as such by the authoritative Diccionario de la lengua espanola de la Real Academia Espanola.

Meanings

• The Anglosphere: Latino migrants to the U.S. occasionally use the term as a more derogatory synonym of Anglo. however, it is also said the term may apply to anyone who lives in the U.S. regardless of race.
  
• In Mexico, El Salvador and Colombia, the term applies exclusively for U.S. citizens, widely accepted as a colloquial demonym. Depending on the context, it may or may not be pejorative.
  
• In Central America, the word is not pejorative. In Cuba, Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, and Panama the term refers to U.S. citizens (regardless of race). In the Dominican Republic it also means a non-free range store bought chicken (pollo gringo). In Puerto Rico, the term refers to U.S. citizens in the U.S. mainland.
  
• In the countries of South America where this term is used, the word is not pejorative. In some countries it may be used to refer to any foreigner who does not speak Spanish as a native language, or in Brazil, someone who does not speak Portuguese as a native language, but in other countries it is used just or especially to refer to U.S. citizens; it may also be used to describe a blond or brunette white native person with soft facial features and light colored eyes. For instance, it is a popular nickname.
  
  • In Uruguay it is used to refer to citizens of the United States in a non pejorative way.
    
  • In Peru the word gringo is used all over the country among the white and non white population. It is used to refer to White people, particularly those with fairer features. It is not pejorative.
    
  • In Ecuador the word gringo can be used to refer to foreigners from any country, not only the United States, though the likelihood of being described as a gringo increases the closer one's physical appearance is to that of a stereotypical northern European.
    
  • In Argentina it was used in the past to refer to European immigrants. In modern times the term is rarely used at all, but it can be used to refer to small and medium farmers from the Pampas that still use it as a nickname.
    

Folk etymologies

There are many popular but unsupported etymologies for this word, many of which relate it to the United States Army in some way or another.

Mexican-American War

A recurring etymology of gringo states that it originated during the Mexican-American War of 1846-48. This theory holds that Gringo comes from 'green coat,' used in reference to the American soldiers and the green color of their uniforms. Yet another story, from Mexico, holds that Mexicans with knowledge of the English language used to write 'greens go home' on street walls referring to the color of the uniforms of the invading army and subsequently it became common for the rest of the population to yell 'green go' whenever U.S. soldiers passed by. These explanations are unlikely, since the U.S. Army did not use green uniforms until the 1940s, but rather blue ones, and after that brown (early 20th century including World War I). Another assertion maintains that one of two songs - either 'Green Grow the Lilacs' or 'O Green Grow the Rushes' - was popular at the time and that Mexicans heard the invading U.S. troops singing 'Green grow...' and contracted this into gringo. However, there is ample evidence that the use of the word predates the Mexican-American War.

Other 'green' derivations

In the Dominican Republic it is said that the term was a mispronunciation of the words 'green gold,' referring to the green color of U.S. currency, as well as the corruption of the exclamation: 'green go!' said to have voiced local opposition within the volatile context of both U.S. military interventions to the island. Another interpretation makes a generalized character judgment of U.S. citizens: 'they see 'green' (money) and they 'go' (after it).'

'Greek' hypothesis

According to the Catalan etymologist Joan Coromines, gringo is derived from griego (Spanish for 'Greek'), the archetypal term for an unintelligible language (a usage found also in the Shakespearean 'it was Greek to me' and its derivative 'It's all Greek to me'). From referring simply to language, it was extended to people speaking foreign tongues and to their physical features ? similar to the development of the ancient Greek word ???????? (bárbaros), 'barbarian.' Still, scholars are not in agreement about the correct origin of this word.

Brazil

In Brazil, the meaning and use of gringo differs significantly from the Spanish-speaking Latin American countries.

Etymologically, the word is documented as not native to the European Portuguese language and is actually borrowed from Spanish since the 19th century at least. Thus the Greek reference is reinforced there as the word 'grego' for Greek in Portuguese (without the 'i') would not have given 'gringo.' Also in Brazilian or even Portuguese popular culture, someone unintelligible is traditionally said to speak Greek (sometimes German or, much more recently, Chinese).

This is also reflected in that the word usage is not naturally widespread and only generally in regions exposed to tourism like Rio de Janeiro. There, the word means basically any foreigner, North American, European or even Latin American, though generally applying more to any English-speaking person and not necessarily based on race or skin color but rather on attitude and clothing. The word for fair skinned and blond people would be rather 'Alemao' (i.e., German).

In S?o Paulo, the word is used to refer to any foreigner at all. It is also used as 'gringa,' meaning any other country than Brazil. Sometimes, the word 'gringo' is used to say that something is different and nicer than usually: 'the food in that restaurant is gringo,' meaning that the food is very tasty and worthy.

In English

'Gringo' has been in use in the English language since the 19th century. According to the Oxford English Dictionary, the first recorded use of the term in an English source is in John W. Audubon's Western Journal of 1849;[7] Audubon recalls that he and his associates were derided and called 'Gringoes' while passing through the town of Cerro Gordo, Veracruz. The earliest recorded use of the word in an English-language context is in an 1871 article from the Albuquerque, New Mexico newspaper The Republican Review, which describes an assault by three Mexican American men on an evidently Anglo-American woman, whom they called 'a gringo bitch.'[7]

Other uses

In Mexican cuisine, a gringa is a flour tortilla taco al pastor with cheese, heated on the comal and then served with a salsa de chile (chile sauce).

In the 1950s, the blue Fifty Mexican peso bill was called an ojo de gringa ('gringa's eye').

Gringolandia

The word Gringolandia (Gringoland) is a mock, single-word name for the United States of America. Gringolandia derives from the compounding of the words 'gringo' and '-landia' (land of) into this term. This composition was inspired by the word Disneyland (from the name Disney and the word land), which in Spanish was translated as Disneylandia. Walt Disney's movies and cartoons have always been popular in Mexico, and they inspired the mock name 'Gringolandia.'

The term is also used by natives of Quito, Ecuador to describe a sector of the city called La Mariscal. This neighborhood is the entertainment and tourism hub of Quito, and subsequently attracts many foreigners. Hotels, restaurants, bars, and shops in La Mariscal cater to tourists, students, expats, and business travellers coming from many parts of the world, particularly from English-speaking countries, and so it is jokingly nicknamed Gringolandia.

[Tommy Lee]

Bylem w Tijuanie w zeszlym roku. Przekroczylismy granice na pieszo - chcielismy sie wybrac autobusem do centrum (bo znajomi mowili ze tam "normalniej"i bezpieczniej) ale juz te przygraniczne slumsy nas mocno zniechecily, wiec po walnieciu paru drinkow wrocilismy do san diego. W wielu przygranicznych miastach glownie po stronie meksyku jest teraz ostra jatka wiec na pewno trzeba uwazac.

niestety potwierdzam, wycieczka na kilka godzin i najlepiej w trakcie dnia, samochod radze zostawic w san diego. niezbyt bezpiecznie sie tam czulem mimo, ze bylem z 2 kumplami. kilka drinkow, dobry meksykanski obiadek i do san diego...

[isztar]

Witam. Chciałam się dowiedzieć jak wygląda przekraczanie granicy USA-Meksyk na wizie turystycznej? Czy przy wjeździe do Meksyku trzeba o jakieś dodatkowe dokumenty się fatygować, żeby bez problemu wrócić do USA?

Dzięki za informację jakąkolwiek

[sly6]

isztar a masz wize wielokrotnego przekroczenia granicy ?

[isztar]

Ojj, nie mam zielonego pojęcia. Wize mam na 2 lata. Pod hasłem ENTRIES jest M więc śmiem podejrzewać, że jest to wiza wielokrotnego wjazdu, ale jest to moja pierwsza wiza do USA więc jestem zielona w tym temacie...

[sly6]

I dobrze podejrzewasz bo M oznacza taka wize

[uga-buga]

Przy wizie turystycznej w pobliskich krajach typu Meksyk, Kanada i kilka wysp karaibskich (np Bahamas z tego co pamietam) nie trzeba od nowa wypelniac I-94 i czas spedzony tam nie zmiejsza czasu pobytowego w USA, czyli jak masz np wbity polroczny pobyt i jedziesz po 3 miesiacach do Meksyku z USA, spedzasz tam miesiac to zostaje ci kolejne 2 w USA

W przypadku visa waiver nie ma opcji, ale chyba przy zwyklych turystycznych jezeli to jest rozwaizanie niewygodne mozna I-94 oddac i wtedy od nowa ubiegac sie o wjazd na pol roku - ale nikt nie mowi, ze wtedy urzednik musi sie zgodzic

Ze starym I-94 wjazd jest "prawie" murowany

"Gringo" bardzo zadko jest pejoratywne, poza tym latino-hiszpanski ma o wiele bardziej bogaty zasob bluzgow, wiec jak ktos bedzie was chcial obrazic to raczej nie bedzie watpliwosci ;-)